> I also think the registries should actually be registries and
> not try to be the Internet's mommy.
IMHO it is part of an IP registry's job to make sure that applications for
IP address space meet the publicly agreed upon criteria. And if that
criteria says that you need to justify the quantity of addresses you
receive, it may be mommy work but it is necessary work. But I want to know
why ARIN cannot simply issue an appropriately sized portable block of
addresses to anyone who is legitimately multihomed? Why can't ARIN
maintain a register of companies who are multihomed and tag their IP
allocations, of whatever size, as "portable". I suppose we could sidestep
Sprint and use the swamp addresses which Sprint filters on a /24 boundary.
But why can't we just carve off a chunk of 214/8 and "register" it to
organizations who need portable space in chunks smaller than /19?
This just makes too much sense to me.
Michael,
Could you define "legitimately multihomed" please?
I think that a prime example would be a site such as
progressive networks, cnn (turner), msbnc, or any other high
traffic site.
They will be multiply connected to major providers,
but most use some sort of ip director, and all their
machines sit on the same /24.
Although I don't like the way some of these peoples networks
are built, they don't have enough machines/servers to justify anything
more than a /24 or even at most a /22, but still need provider
independent space as they may show up at regional exchange points.
The best bet for these people in some cases is to go hunt for
space that is "available", as ARIN and folks won't allocate such space.
Their other option is to sit on the network block of
one of their providers, but some people do have issues with
announcing other providers address space (like it's against their
internal policies).
This would be a semi-justfiable use of a portable block
less than a /19, would it not?
I can define the "multihomed" part easily enough. However I think I would
rather hear what ARIN members have to say about the "legitimately" part.
There probably is a working definition already existing inpractice if not
in words. There are already a number of organizations who are multihomed
and who are announcing routes that are trapped by the nasty, naughty
Sprint filters. I suspect that if we examine those organizations we would
find some shared characteristics that would go a long way to defining
legitimacy.
Also, to be legitimately multihomed is to be a participant in the core of
the Internet. One could probably come up with a definition of what
technical standards must be met in order to participate in the Internet
core and then extrapolate legitimacy from that. Two 14.4kbps upstream
providers wouldn't fit the bill.
Note that I am not now and never have been a sheriff in the state of
Kansas. I am actually somebody else who does not work for Best.
core and then extrapolate legitimacy from that. Two 14.4kbps upstream
providers wouldn't fit the bill.
On the other hand, how many people running dual 14.4's are really running
BGP sessions over them? Is a specific bit-rate/sec required when that
would be even harder to verify than multiple upstream connections? what
about people with dual residential xDSL connections?
I agree. Determining who these handful of people are should
be reasonably easy, they tend to be large sites already dedicated to
providing such services though. A clear example of someone in the future
would be a streaming audio/video site with the latest and greatest
technology.
I was curious, so took a quick look at the cnn.com
bgp announcement (/24), if you look at this, and think for a
second, if they (AS5662) were connected to MCI/CW rather than
Sprint, they would be unreachable with this announcement, other
than the fact that ANS would be announcing the aggregate, and following
that path, rather than having the actual as-path be traversed.
- jared
route-views.oregon-ix.net>sh ip b 207.25.71.0 255.255.255.0 longer-prefixes
BGP table version is 111835909, local router ID is 198.32.162.100
Status codes: s suppressed, d damped, h history, * valid, > best, i - internal
Origin codes: i - IGP, e - EGP, ? - incomplete
Network Next Hop Metric LocPrf Weight Path
* 207.25.71.0 206.157.77.11 0 0 1673 1333 5662 i
* 204.42.253.253 0 267 1225 701 5662 5662 i
* 204.212.44.129 1 0 234 1225 701 5662 5662 i
* 202.232.1.8 0 2497 701 5662 5662 i
* 129.250.0.1 0 0 2914 1 5662 5662 i
* 192.121.154.25 0 1755 1800 1239 5662 5662 i
* 144.228.240.93 59 0 1239 5662 5662 i
* 193.0.0.56 0 3333 286 1 5662 5662 i
* 158.43.206.96 0 1849 702 701 5662 5662 i
* 194.68.130.254 0 5459 5413 1 5662 5662 i
* 134.55.24.6 0 293 1 5662 5662 i
* 12.127.0.249 0 7018 5662 5662 i
* 134.24.127.3 0 1740 7018 5662 5662 i
*> 4.0.0.2 640 0 1 5662 5662 i
* 204.70.4.89 0 3561 1 5662 5662 i
* 129.250.0.3 0 0 2914 1673 1333 5662 i
I'm still getting over the 14.4Kbps connections. Why aren't they dual
33.6kbps at the least, mybe 56kbps? At least, 28.8kbps ... but
14.4kbps?!?!?!? They need to spend a few shekels on modems! I suppose it's
better than 9.6kbps.<sigh>
I'll ROTFALMAO if I hear someone trying an InterNet connection at 300 baud.
> I'll ROTFALMAO if I hear someone trying an InterNet connection at 300 baud.
Done it, and routed a /24
Don't ask.
-g
-- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- --
ISPF, The Forum for ISPs by ISPs. October 26-28, 1998, Atlanta, GA.
Three days of clues, news, and views from the industry's best and
brightest. http://www.ispf.com/ for information and registration.
Atheism is a non-prophet organization. I route, therefore I am.
Alex Rubenstein, alex@nac.net, KC2BUO, ISP/C Charter Member
Father of the Network and Head Bottle-Washer
Net Access Corporation, 9 Mt. Pleasant Tpk., Denville, NJ 07834
Don't choose a spineless ISP; we have more backbone! http://www.nac.net
-- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- --
Was much less painful testing with a Hayes SmartModem 1200.
I really miss the fast handshakes and no-bullshit connection speeds.
*grin*
[note for randy: I dunno how to config a cisco for this, but with
3com HDSPs, ya go to the console or management s/w and set 'enable
300 bps' and/or 'enable 1200 bps' appropriately.]
I had other machines and modems before it, but the platform that I had /great/ passion for was my Apple ][ with an Apple Cat 1200 modem. Great firmware and tools for doing all kinds of coolio phone tricks (digital answering machine,blue-boxing, etc. "way back in the day."
Aren't networks cool -- even those old fashioned circuit-switched ones?
