Is anyone from SORBS still listening? We have a few IP addresses here and there that are listed, one in particular that has been for a spam incident from over a year ago. The "last spam" date is 03/05/2011 according to their lookup tools.
We don't have access to their Net Manager even if our ARIN POC corresponds to the account on their system we opened a while ago. We use their ISP feedback form and never get any responses back.
Good luck. Last time we heard back from them they were trying to extort
us for $18,000 to have a huge block of Ips removed. They were listed from
the day we received them from arin. After that we gave up on SORBS.
They're still functional, still used by companies but I wouldn't make any observation on them running 'well'. A friend's office IP range got blocked and unblocked recently by them so they do seem to remove entries.
Beyond that on NANOG you're pretty much into "light blue touch paper and retire to a safe distance" territory even mentioning them. There is a good chance you might get a reply from Sorbs here, they almost always seem to respond when things get raised on NANOG.
I've been trying to login to their 'support' interface for a while now.
Emails from them for creating a new account or trying to recover a
password for an existing account don't actually come to me. I actually
wrote Girish from the company that purchased SORBS (Proofpoint) about it
(also CC'd here) and I have had no reply whatsoever either.
I think we should all just NULL ROUTE all of their IP space on our borders
to get their attention.
I think we should all just NULL ROUTE all of their IP space on our borders
to get their attention.
Yeah you're free to do that, as well as complain about it and SORBS in turn is free to put whatever the hell they feel like on their block lists and not remove it at all, ever, for whatever reason.
One common theme I did notice in the countless and, dare I say, tiresome complaints about SORBS is that it hardly ever helps and may even make it worse.
It's best to not complain about it and just accept it as a fact of life your IPs are listed on SORBS and move on. It's not the end of the world.
By a happy coincidence, I got mail today from Scott Greco of Proofpoint,
asking if we could get together to discuss their products. I've replied
to that with a summary of this thread, and am Cc:ing him on this mail, as
well. Maybe we can get their attention, though past experience with SORBS
does not exactly imbue me with confidence.
We had an issue with one of our old subnets which was used as a pool for dynamic dial-up in the past, which we now use for virtual hosting.
It took a few me a few hours but I was able to get it removed from the DUHL list.
( And a few walk around the block to calm me down after dealing with their robot =D ).
As for being removed from their SPAM RBL that might be another story..
Actually knowing Chris, and his outfit, that 18k request seems unwarranted
As for SORBS, they have a ticket system at http://support.sorbs.net/ which use the same username/password as https://www.us.sorbs.net. You can follow up there with your ticket #, if their robot is being a bit too fascist.
( ecarbonel was the guy that help us in our case )
PS: The ticketing system is not that fast, so be patient.
I think we should all just NULL ROUTE all of their IP space on our borders
to get their attention.
Yeah you're free to do that, as well as complain about it and SORBS in
turn is free to put whatever the hell they feel like on their block lists
and not remove it at all, ever, for whatever reason.
The latter part of that sentence has already been confirmed for years now.
It's best to not complain about it and just accept it as a fact of life
your IPs are listed on SORBS and move on. It's not the end of the world.
It turns into a customer service issue for most service providers.
As for SORBS, they have a ticket system at http://support.sorbs.net/which use the same username/password as https://www.us.sorbs.net. You can follow up there with your ticket #, if
their robot is being a bit too fascist. ( ecarbonel was the guy that help
us in our case )
Yeah that's my main complaint right now is that we can't get into their
ticket system *or* register a new account for our AS. The new account
registration email never gets received for confirmation. The account we
used to use doesn't work despite it being somewhere around 7 years old.
PS: The ticketing system is not that fast, so be patient.
It's better than it was a few months ago I must say. It was almost
absolutely unusably slow the last time I was in there probably late last
year some time.
Some of the IP's I manage got blacklisted and its true they were spamming
and Sorbs had a very valid reason for blacklisting them.
I got this response response from sorbs after resolving the problem
amicably. Sorbs responded well on time.
*Your request appear to have been resolved. If you have any
further questions or concerns, please respond to this message.
Please note:
If your IP address has been delisted (marked as 'Inactive'), it will
take up to 2 hours to get from the database to all the SORBS DNS
servers. Changes to the database are exported to the DNS zone files
periodically, not immediately after every change. Furthermore, after
the updated database contents have been exported to the DNS zone
files, it will then take up to 48 hours for the outdated DNS
information to be removed from DNS caches around the world - none
of these are in SORBS' control.
Please do not reply to this call with problems not related to
this ticket or your request will be ignored.
Now, if we could only teach Senderbase that if their customers receive 'questionable' smtp traffic from 1 IP address in a /24 it doesn't mean that all IP addresses in that /24 are malicious we'd really be living it up in 2012.
Now, if we could only teach Senderbase that if their customers receive
'questionable' smtp traffic from 1 IP address in a /24 it doesn't mean that
all IP addresses in that /24 are malicious we'd really be living it up in
2012.
This is often the only way to get peoples attention and get action.
Providers dont care about individual /32's and will let them sit around
and spew nigerian scams and pill spams without any consequences.
But they will care about a /24.
-Dan
If the purpose of blacklist is to block spam for recipients using that
blacklist then a /32 works. If the purpose of a blacklist is to annoy
providers then a /24 works. The most reputable and useful blacklists IMHO
are Spamhaus and Spamcop - they don't block /24s. Spamhaus sometimes does
if your rwhois shows that a large amount of the /24 is owned by the
offending party but generally they don't. In my opinion a blacklist is
useful when it notifies a provider of a listing, provides the reason for
the listing and gives you a way to remove the listing.
Spamhaus encourages companies to resolve all the issues while only blocking
/32s by showing all the listings under your responsibility and making nice
to see that list empty. Pretty simple. Incidentally SORBS usually blocks
/24s and, as far as I know, provides no way for you to lookup all listings
under a providers responsibility (by AS or otherwise).
Incidentally, I have yet to see anything from Proofpoint, SORBS or their
support system regarding the access issues we are having to their system.
If anyone has another contact at Proofpoint other than Girish I'd
appreciate knowing what it is.
I moved "into" a /24 ip block that was SWIPed to me that they reported was
"dynamic cable/DSL users" (no spam history, mind you). Didn't matter, I
couldn't send e-mail.
When trying to get it delisted I had a TTL on the zone that was
"incompatible" with their standards (for DR failover purposes) and was
unwilling to maintain a TTL of how many ever hours they wanted as it didn't
fit the company's requirements.
I ended up just getting a new IP block from the ISP as they gave up on
resolving it too. Kind of a waste, but it worked. I relocated to there
instead.
1 year later they updated my ticket and delisted it.
That's just not true, we would much rather be notified of something that a reputation list finds objectionable and take it down ourselves than have Senderbase set a poor reputation on dozens of IaaS customers.
If it was industry-wide standard practice that just notifying a provider resulted
in something being done, we'd not need things like Senderbase, which is after
all basically a list of people who don't take action when notified...
Senderbase's listings don't correlate to any public information so it's pretty much impossible to pro-actively protect ourselves from having our IPs set to poor.
I.e. when Senderbase assigns IPs to poor, those same IPs aren't listed on any RBLs or anything.
They operate in a vacuum where there is no visibility into why they do anything. Unlike organizations like Spamhaus where you know exactly why IPs are listed.
Eh, guess they'll just have to absorb the cost of that, like its expected that the recipients of spam have to absorb the cost of ISPs not disconnecting infected/spamming customers...
And like how I have to absorb the costs of spending my time during the day answering removal requests from people who lie to me constantly and hope that I don't notice their little games.
Ever wonder why it takes time for DNSbl's to process removals, sometimes very long periods? Well, someone's gotta pay for that time the removal person does it (and I have yet to see a dime of compensation for the time I spend).
No, they don't. Many DNSBLs use self-service tools. Someone has to write the tool, but the rest is automated. Total cost is power & space, which is frequently donated (I have personally donated some myself to DNSBLs I thought were well run).
Besides, anyone who knowingly causes harm to a third party and claims "it is a cost of doing business" or "mostly people like it" or "our $FOO is targeted and almost always correct, you must be an outlier and that's why it costs you" sound -exactly- like spammers to me.
Spammer who are up-front about it I can deal with. Don't agree with or even like them, but at least we understand each other. Hypocrisy is a different story.
