RE: Compromised Hosts?

We're a regional broadband (cable/dsl) provider with 100K+ subs and we do act on any notification regarding any one of our IP's participating in a DDOS. The most useful into is to state it is a DDOS, it is affecting service for you, the time/date and the IP of the source. Traffic details always help. Our downfall is that due to the number of "notifications", our abuse team sometimes gets behind; sometimes issues are not acted on until after the DDOS has ceased. Regardless, they are contacted, warned, their account is noted, and if the behavior occurs again, they are disconnected until they are cleaned.

I think it's difficult for the national guys to do this mainly because of the number of complaints that are received; most e-mails are automated, most from innocent probes or misconfigured firewalls - very few contain useful info or are DDOS's.

--Dan

We get a lot of automated complaints. A human reads all of
them, and act on some of them. I'm particularly fond of the
dozen-a-week "Source quench" attack emails we get, where Joe
Guy's IDS identifies the single source quench packet from a
DSL Cpe as malicious. Perhaps next time we should give our
ICMP control messages friendlier names. :slight_smile:

-Ejay

From: owner-nanog@merit.edu [mailto:owner-nanog@merit.edu]

On

Behalf Of Dan Ellis
Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2004 6:51 PM
To: nanog@merit.edu
Subject: RE: Compromised Hosts?

We're a regional broadband (cable/dsl) provider with 100K+

subs and we do act on any notification regarding any one

of

our IP's participating in a DDOS. The most useful into is

to

state it is a DDOS, it is affecting service for you, the
time/date and the IP of the source. Traffic details

always

help. Our downfall is that due to the number of
"notifications", our abuse team sometimes gets behind;
sometimes issues are not acted on until after the DDOS has

ceased. Regardless, they are contacted, warned, their
account is noted, and if the behavior occurs again, they

are

disconnected until they are cleaned.

I think it's difficult for the national guys to do this
mainly because of the number of complaints that are

received;

most e-mails are automated, most from innocent probes or
misconfigured firewalls - very few contain useful info or

are DDOS's.

--Dan

--
Daniel Ellis, CTO - PenTeleData
(610)826-9293

   "The only way to predict the future is to invent it."
                                      --Alan Kay

From: Deepak Jain [mailto:deepak@ai.net]
Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2004 7:26 PM
To: nanog@merit.edu
Subject: Compromised Hosts?

Nanogers -

  Would any broadband providers that received

automated, detailed

(time/date stamp, IP information) with hosts that are

being used to

attack (say as part of a DDOS attack) actually do anything

about it?

  Would the letter have to include information like
"x.x.x.x/32 has been
blackholed until further notice or contact with you" to be

effective?

If anyone had imagined a million windows twits with
blackice and enough free time to e-mail every alias
they could find sending in complaints (along with
threats to report you to the FBI, CIA, and DHS, as
well as sue you, your router vendor, and your dog)
every time your evil webserver hacked them by
responding to their port 80 connection when the ICMP
spec was written, they would have named them ICMP NOT
ECHO AN REPLY ATTACK etc. Perhaps if more people were
RFC3514 compliant... :slight_smile:

Bottom line, it is remarkably difficult to take action
based on random internet complaints. If there is a
well known authoritive source for DoS tracking who
wants to publish a list to ISP's fine, but don't
expect the same reaction to random joe blow
complainer.