co-location and access to your server

Cruzio in Santa Cruz recently opened a little co-location facility. That makes two of such facilities in Santa Cruz (the other being got.net), which could be a good thing for competition.

Their 1U offer comes with limited access to your server, only from 10AM to 6 PM. I find that not acceptable. Why wait until 10 AM when a disk breaks at 8 PM? But maybe I am being too picky.

What is considered normal with regards to access to your co-located server(s)? Especially when you're just co-locating one or a few servers.

Thanks,
Jeroen

24x7x365

When you are talking single or partial rack colo it is generally done as escorted only, due to security. They can't have anyone coming in and poking around other customers hardware without being watched. We do the same thing but we allow 24x7 escorted access. Half and full racks get 24x7 access also but that is because they are individually locked.

The answer, as always, is "how much do you want to pay?" There are lots of
cheap places that make it a hassle for you to get in so you use their remote
hands, or just let you in on their terms so they don't have to keep the
place open at night.

-Jack Carrozzo

What is considered normal with regards to access to your co-located
server(s)? Especially when you're just co-locating one or a few servers.

Normally you need an escort so you don't go fiddling with other
people's hardware. Our provider has a callout fee if we want to get in
at nights or weekends.

If you're co-locating with us, you have access to your equipment 24x7.

And we are also staffed 24x7 in the event you can't get to our location for whatever reason...(vacation etc...)

Colo's have their own rules I suppose, did you know about this before hosting with them?

For less than 1 rack, or specialty racks with lockable sections (1/2 or 1/3 or 1/4 racks with their own doors), I'd consider any physical access to simply be a plus. I wouldn't expect any at all. You're not paying for enough space to justify the costs involved in 24x7 independant access, and the risks to other customers gear.

When you get a full rack+, or cage+, I'd expect unfettered 24x7 access since your gear should be seperated and secured from other folks gear. Some specialty providers would be exceptions, of course (ie, I used to colo gear inside tv stations, satellite downlink stations, etc).

Telecom colo (switch and network gear in a dedicated but shared space for providers providing service) would be an exception, of course.

When you are talking single or partial rack colo it is generally done as escorted only, due to security. They can't have anyone coming in and poking around other customers hardware without being watched. We do the same thing but we allow 24x7 escorted access. Half and full racks get 24x7 access also but that is because they are individually locked.

--
Matt

Cruzio in Santa Cruz recently opened a little co-location facility. That makes two of such facilities in Santa Cruz (the other being got.net), which could be a good thing for competition.

Their 1U offer comes with limited access to your server, only from 10AM to 6 PM. I find that not acceptable. Why wait until 10 AM when a disk breaks at 8 PM? But maybe I am being too picky.

What is considered normal with regards to access to your co-located server(s)? Especially when you're just co-locating one or a few servers.

Thanks,
Jeroen

--
Stupid Email Disclaimers
What's the Plural of 'Virus'?

This is beginning to sound like the blind leading the blind & this commentary is too funny.

If you outsource your IT facilities to a ISP and you do not plan for redundancy then the failure is YOURS and not the ISP's limited access policy. The ISP's limited access policy has to do with their overhead models and that's all there is to that.

Sorry to bring daylight into this but it is what it is... YOU MUST plan for redundancy.

Todd Glassey - as a GOT.NET Client

todd glassey wrote:

When you are talking single or partial rack colo it is generally done

policy. The ISP's limited access policy has to do with their overhead models and that's all there is to that.

Sorry to bring daylight into this but it is what it is... YOU MUST plan for redundancy.

Thanks for all the replies, I understand that allowing access to other people's servers unsupervised could be a bad idea. Problem for my specific situation is that the 10 to 6 access is exactly the time I generally am NOT in town.

I guess knowing who entered the building by means of a keycard and having cameras isn't considered enough to deter potential "evil doers". I know it's not enough for places like equinix, but that's of a different caliber.

Thanks,
Jeroen

Paying for 1u of colo justifys a keycard for you, cameras and keycard hardware for the facility? you're paying what, 50-100$ a month, maybe less? you realize that low prices comes at the cost of reduced services?

From: david raistrick
Sent: Wednesday, January 12, 2011 1:44 PM
To: Jeroen van Aart
Cc: NANOG list
Subject: Re: co-location and access to your server

> I guess knowing who entered the building by means of a keycard and
having
> cameras isn't considered enough to deter potential "evil doers". I
know it's
> not enough for places like equinix, but that's of a different
caliber.

Paying for 1u of colo justifys a keycard for you, cameras and keycard
hardware for the facility? you're paying what, 50-100$ a month,

maybe

less? you realize that low prices comes at the cost of reduced
services?

I would say even that hosting other people's hardware on a "one off"
basis isn't even really cost effective. Better, in my opinion, for the
service provider to simply buy a rack from Rackable or another vendor
and rent the servers out to people. At least you are then dealing with
a known entity as far as hardware goes. Housing who knows what gives
you a potential mix of things like front to back, back to front, and
side to side airflow; an assortment of network issues due to an
assortment of NICs in the network; people wanting physical access to
their servers for things like driver replacement, etc.

Even having someone willing to allow individuals to house their own
single servers in a rack is amazing. Complaining about the service as
far as access just seems like looking the gift horse in the mouth!

I treat all my colo customers as 24 hour (escorted) access.

~Seth

Having the infrastructure in place to support full cab customers already
and 24/7 remote hands, the cost of providing 24/7 access to smaller colo
customers is negligible.

We could issue a card to every single server one of our colo customers
for only the one-time cost of the card. It doesn't make sense for most
single-server customers because a tech still has to go into the data
center, unlock the cabinet, fetch a crash cart, etc, so he might as well
let them in the front door.

I guess what you're saying holds true if the facility doesn't already
offer /anyone/ this access regardless of how much equipment and space
they have.

You're talking about a dedicated server business versus colocation.
Colocation can be a better solution if you have special needs for
hardware or want to not pay for the extra overhead that needs to be
built-in for supporting dedicated hardware (like stocking replacement
parts, paying for the server's original purchase cost, extra fees for
upgrade hardware, etc).

Colo also lets customers move their hardware around if they ever want to
change providers, rather than have to do a soft migration and to deliver
a prepared server to a facility they can set up at home or in their
office beforehand. Depending on your exact needs, some of these things
might outweigh the benefits of a dedicated server from the data center
operator.

As a colo provider, if you set up and enforce rules regarding mounting,
air flow, cabling, etc and confirm them when the customer brings them to
the facility, this problem does not really exist.

In our facilities, customers are welcome to come in to work on their
hardware at any time 24/7. We do not guarantee or offer that we will
have the parts or tools needed to service the equipment and encourage
customers to send us those things as needed or take care of the hardware
personally in order to deal with any such concerns.

This has never been a problem for us.

If it were cheap and I needed a secondary site for backups and DR then I
would live with that. Otherwise no.

Kevin Stange wrote:

I guess what you're saying holds true if the facility doesn't already
offer /anyone/ this access regardless of how much equipment and space
they have.

They offer 24/7 access to 1/3 racks or more.

The price is not that low, $100/month for 1*1U and 1 IP. I'd say that's not a sales bin style rock bottom price where expecting even free coffee is excessive. :wink:

There is another small colo in town which to the best of my knowledge does provide 24/7 access with a keycard.

Greetings,
Jeroen

From: Kevin Stange

You're talking about a dedicated server business versus colocation.
Colocation can be a better solution if you have special needs for
hardware or want to not pay for the extra overhead that needs to be
built-in for supporting dedicated hardware (like stocking replacement
parts, paying for the server's original purchase cost, extra fees for
upgrade hardware, etc).

Colo also lets customers move their hardware around if they ever want
to change providers, rather than have to do a soft migration and to
deliver a prepared server to a facility they can set up at home or in
their office beforehand. Depending on your exact needs, some of these
things might outweigh the benefits of a dedicated server from the data
center operator.

Agreed on the above two points. I was thinking that it was great just to find someone these days that would accept a one-off server and that should be enough to be thankful for! The access requirements can be a pain but if you are in a shared cabinet, you have people installing rack mounts, pulling servers in and out around your stuff, etc. I can see where I would probably want the colo provider to have someone supervising what that other customer is doing right next to my server (did he cover my air vents with a bunch of cables?) The degree of clue varies widely between people who might want to collocate a single server and if I am unlucky enough to be hosted directly above/below someone who is in/out of their server every week, I might get a little nervous. Knowing that there is someone with a bit more clue (does that for a living) supervising (or at least witnessing) might ease my anxiety somewhat about what is going on in the cabinet where I am being hosted.

As a colo provider, if you set up and enforce rules regarding mounting,
air flow, cabling, etc and confirm them when the customer brings them
to the facility, this problem does not really exist.

To some extent, that is true. I guess it depends on what is going on, too. Does the customer arrive, request their server and the colo provider pulls it for them and deliver it to a work area or does the customer go get the server themselves under supervision of the colo provider? There can be a lot of variables.

In our facilities, customers are welcome to come in to work on their
hardware at any time 24/7. We do not guarantee or offer that we will
have the parts or tools needed to service the equipment and encourage
customers to send us those things as needed or take care of the
hardware personally in order to deal with any such concerns.

This has never been a problem for us.

Awesome. It's good to know that there are still operations like that around. That is probably found more often in local providers and not so often in the big operations. The more community oriented providers would be much more accepting of such a situation than a large operation.

But having clueful people around 24x7 to assist customers in shared cabinets may not be effective for them if they have just opened up and might not have a lot of customers yet. If they only get one or two customers who come in after hours, I could see where they might figure it isn't cost effective for them to have staff on the swing and graveyard shifts. Larger operations might have an easier time with that, but having someone "on call" probably isn't that bad if it is infrequently needed.

George Bonser wrote:

Awesome. It's good to know that there are still operations like that around. That is probably found more often in local providers and not so often in the big operations. The more community oriented providers would be much more accepting of such a situation than a large operation.

Community oriented provider, that's what I am talking about. I just couldn't find the right term.

but having someone "on call" probably isn't that bad if it is infrequently needed.

I'd be willing to pay extra for access after hours, either a recurring fee or on a case by case basis. I am not searching for the cheapest option and demanding that in addition my car be detailed weekly. But just some co-locating space for one or a few servers where I don't have to plan a week ahead or miss half a day of $dayjob in order to work on it (which would cost me more).

Greetings,
Jeroen

I was thinking that it was great just to find someone these days
that would accept a one-off server and that should be enough to
be thankful for!

Especially true with providers like SoftLayer which can turn up a
fully dedicated server to spec at any of several locations within a
few hours. No hardware to manage or worrying about getting direct
access at all. They even give you the ability to cycle the outlet(s)
the server is plugged into if needed. Unless there is some really
specialized hardware, location-specific or regulatory need, I couldn't
imagine a desire to deal with putting my own single box at a co-lo
anymore. Of course, since you're leasing the box you pay a premium
over a pure bare-bones co-lo, but it vastly simplifies things.

-Justin Scott

That's true. Most dedicated server providers will get you remote power
outlet control and many can get you remote console (IPMI, DRAC) as an
included feature, so you can take care of almost all administration on
your own, including OS reinstalls and fscks.

There's still sometimes an edge in price and control when you use your
own hardware and that's definitely worth it for some.