Best TAC Services from Equipment Vendors

Thought about it but so far I believe companies from China provide better and fast TAC responses to their customers than the likes of Cisco and perhaps that’s why some companies(where there are no restrictions)prefer them for critical services.

For a short period in TAC call you can have over 10 R&D engineers and solutions provided in a matter of hours even if it involves software changes… while these other companies even before you get in a call with a TAC engineer it’s hours and when they join you hear something like “my shift ended 15 minutes ago, hold let me look for another engineer”. WHY? Thoughts

Interesting, this has never been my experience even with Cisco or Juniper, have always been able to escalate quickly to engineering. I wonder if it was related to the size of my accounts.

Shane

For us this has been the experience to a point where 100s of nodes( from vendor x) had to be swapped out because no one had the patience anymore…

Funny you should mention this now, we were just discussing (more like lamenting…) if support is a dying industry. It seems as though vendor budgets are shrinking to the point they only have a Sales/Pre-Sales department, and from Day Two on you are on your own. Dramatic take of course, but if we are speaking in trajectories…

Funny you should mention this now, we were just discussing (more like lamenting...) if support is a dying industry. It seems as though vendor budgets are shrinking to the point they only have a Sales/Pre-Sales department, and from Day Two on you are on your own. Dramatic take of course, but if we are speaking in trajectories....

My personal experience extending in three different decades is that
there is no meaningful change in support quality or amount of issues
encountered.

Support quality has always been very modest, unless you specifically
pay to have access to named engineers. And this is not because quality
of the engineers changes, this is because vast majority of support
cases are useless cases, and to handle this massive volume support
tries to assume which support cases are legitimate problems, which are
PEBKAC and in which cases the user already solved their problem by the
time you read their ticket and will never respond back. The last case
is so common that every first-line adopts the strategy of 'pinging'
you, regardless how good and clear information you provide, they ask
some soft-ball question, to see if you're still engaged.
Having a named engineer changes this process, because the engineer
will quickly learn that you don't open useless cases, that the issue
you're having is legitimate, and will actually read the ticket and
think about the problem.

To me this seems an inevitable outcome, if your product is popular,
most of its users are users who don't do their homework and do not
respect the support line's time, which ends up being a disservice to
the whole ecosystem, because legitimate problems will take longer to
fix, or in case of open source software, authors just burn out and
kill the project.

What shocks me more than the low quality support is the low quality
software, decades pass along, and everyone still is having
show-stopper level of issues in basic functions on a regular basis,
the software quality is absolutely abysmal. I fear low software
quality is organically market-driven, no one is trying to make poor
NOS, it's just market incentives drive poor quality NOS. When no one
has high quality NOS, there is no reason to develop one, because most
of your revenue is support contracts, not hardware sales, and if the
NOS wouldn't be out-right broken needing to be recompiled regularly to
get basic things working, lot of users might stop buying support,
because they don't need the hand-holding part of it, they just need
working software.
This is not something that vendors actively drive, I'm sure most
companies believe they are making an honest attempt to improve
quality, but it is visible in where investments are put. One vendor
had a very promising project to take a holistic look into their NOS
quality issue, by senior subject matter experts, this project was
killed (I'm sure funding was needed somewhere with better returns),
and the responsible senior person went to Amazon instead.

No way - I never understood why HP and VMware support would call me 12/24 hours after I raised a case, essentially read it back to me and conclude with ‘okay assigning to an engineer now’. I last dealt with either of them 7 years ago but things haven’t likely changed.

This is it, to check if I’m still there! Quite absurd though to create a dependency on a phone call to start working on a support case for which I selected the email/portal contact method if you ask me though.

G

With all honesty, if you ask me, my experience with most companies from China-in relation to Support- has always been fast and super satisfactory no matter the raised case or sensitivity of the impact to users. I have always felt comfortable running their gear and gives some sort of confidence in not having prolonged outages no matter the reasons( engineer inexperienced, not knowledgeable)

* I am biased, I’m from Arista * but having said that have you guys experienced Arista TAC? Not propaganda, I truly see it very differently.
As you guys said scale may change things down the road, but at the current scale it’s still an engineer that answers your call, straight away.

Hi,

Support quality has always been very modest, unless you specifically
pay to have access to named engineers. And this is not because quality
of the engineers changes, this is because vast majority of support
cases are useless cases, and to handle this massive volume support
tries to assume which support cases are legitimate problems, which are
PEBKAC and in which cases the user already solved their problem by the
time you read their ticket and will never respond back. The last case
is so common that every first-line adopts the strategy of 'pinging'
you, regardless how good and clear information you provide, they ask
some soft-ball question, to see if you're still engaged.
Having a named engineer changes this process, because the engineer
will quickly learn that you don't open useless cases, that the issue
you're having is legitimate, and will actually read the ticket and
think about the problem.

This. Absolutely this. I've been a TAC engineer at a major vendor for
a few years in the late 2000s. I found it interesting to observe that
the quality of cases is related to the size of the customer. In my
experience at that time, smaller customers tended to create low quality
cases but scream the loudest.

Following my experiences in TAC and hiring by several large networks, I
would give operations people guidance on how to actually open a TAC
case. More specifically, you know what the first questions will usually
be a canned response like "how long has this been happening, what is the
impact on production", etc. So, I've trained people to include that,
and all relevant logs that a TAC engineer can ask for, in the case to
begin with. And, of course, add a proper synopsis. "Router down" is
not.

Despite not having a named engineer, our cases were handled a lot
quicker all of a sudden.

Lastly, not every vendor has a first line group of juniors. Some
vendors you call will have the phone answered within 30 seconds by
an actual proper TAC engineer who will open the case for you if one
does not exist yet.

Thanks,

Sabri

It may be a pain in the butt to get Cisco equipment, but their TAC is sublime. If something is critical enough, and you push hard enough, Cisco will move heaven and earth to solve your issue.

That honestly is what my experience used to be but this has not been my observation recently, even when we as a large NSP provide all detail and literally ask about possible bugs.

It may be a pain in the butt to get Cisco equipment, but their TAC is sublime. If something is critical enough, and you push hard enough, Cisco will move heaven and earth to solve your issue.

But is this not the problem itself?

Strap in for an “I remember when” …
Once upon a time, I could call (specifically) Cisco TAC, knowing, without any doubt, that my quality problem resolution was inbound, no questions asked. That came to a crashing halt about 15 years ago when a TAC engineer wanted to bounce our Voice VLAN SVI in the middle of an airport production day. I about turned over my desk trying to wrest the remote control session back from him before he hit enter on the shut. Since then, I have had to go through a not insignificant evaluation period of TAC engineers before I let them take control of a remote session, and it is now simply pure instinct to log SSH sessions.

To be honest, if your DR environment has been offline for 3 months and you are just now opening a case, I would not consider that critical.

Shane

You are missing the point, we opened the case 3 months ago

It may be a pain in the butt to get Cisco equipment, but their TAC is sublime. If something is critical enough, and you push hard enough, Cisco will move heaven and earth to solve your issue.

This was an amazing laugh on a Monday morning. Thanks!

Once upon a time, michael brooks - ESC <michael.brooks@adams12.org> said:

Strap in for an "I remember when" ...

My Cisco TAC experiences (which were few) were not great... probably
around 2000 I opened a case with all the details, it was assigned, and
promptly closed "can't reproduce". I didn't have a real lab setup, but
I hauled a spare 7500 and 2924 to my cube, loaded the exact versions in
the ticket, set the config from the ticket, and easily reproduced.
Reopened the ticket and that time they could reproduce it (I believe
they didn't even try the first time) and eventually I got a fix.

The early days of Juniper were much better; I hit a bug and ended up on
a call with the actual developer. I did have to read an RFC section to
them, but they did then acknowledge the mistake and fix it. My SE sent
me an SSG for that one. :slight_smile: Later Juniper could be hit or miss; I did
have a JTAC engineer go extra to help me with a work-around to an
obscure issue.

It may be a pain in the butt to get Cisco equipment, but their TAC is sublime. If something is critical enough, and you push hard enough, Cisco will move heaven and earth to solve your issue.

This was an amazing laugh on a Monday morning. Thanks!

O crap, did I miss the sarcasm?

* I am biased, I’m from Arista * but having said that have you guys experienced Arista TAC?

Yes.

As you guys said scale may change things down the road, but at the current scale it’s still an engineer that answers your call, straight away.

I think the scale has worsened this, slightly, already. It was great initially.

Opening a ticket via web/email after hours seems to get clueless first-level support.

Calling during U.S. business hours has been fine, but I'm generally only doing that to get a ticket moving after it has stalled.

If I have an issue that needs to be escalated to engineering/development, I've had very good to great experiences with the engineers/developers in India after hours. It's a bad day if I need them, but it's great to have them.

FWIW, I haven't tried calling after hours.

On the other hand, the sales engineers have been great!

You sir, not wrong.

You did not. I think you have to know the magic incantation to get Cisco TAC to escalate to the magic level.