--------------- jabley@ca.afilias.info wrote:-----------------
Does anyone have any CCIE (or equivalent technical ability) staff
on a 24x7 shift? What about CCIE level staff on an on-call rota
with a garanteed response time? How about CCNP?
Does anybody actually put any stock in the presence or absence of
vendor certifications on a resume when judging the capabilities of an
engineer?
There's no correlation between certification and capability, in my
experience.
You would if you knew how hard the tests were. ( not counting Microsoft of course)
BF
Farrell,Bob wrote:
You would if you knew how hard the tests were. ( not counting
Microsoft of course)
the tests for a phd in physics are hard. and a very noted net engineer
we all know and deeply respect passed them (and did the thesis) and got
their phd in physics. but, as they said just a couple of weeks ago, and
on this very subject, "would you want me running a nuclear reactor?"
hell no!
randy
Agreed, but apples and oranges to me in that example. I had an engineer that worked for me, then left our org. He spent over 70K in equipment and training out of his own pocket. He failed the CCIE lab 3 times and finally got it as he kept trying on the fourth attempt. He now holds a position in NYC, makes a great living, and I still get accolades from the company he now works for how lucky they were to get him, and what a great job he is doing. His job entails a very high level of responsibility. I think certs provide two things. One, the ability to show that you know what you are doing ( agreed grey area on that one ) , but also the commitment for one to better themselves..... someone I would look at in the hiring process first. Any/every applicant still goes through a rigorous interview process, and the uncertified sometimes win out. Depends on the applicant.
Bob
I think certs provide two things.
One, the ability to show that you know what you are doing (
agreed grey area on that one ) , but also the commitment for
one to better themselves..... someone I would look at in the
hiring process first. Any/every applicant still goes through
a rigorous interview process, and the uncertified sometimes
win out. Depends on the applicant.
Uncertified people absolutely MUST have the commitment to better
themselves since they do their learning in an environment where there
are fewer crutches like books, courses, etc. Often they are uncertified
because by the time the first courses come out, these uncertified people
already have the technical knowledge that the course tries to provide.
On the other hand, there are people out there who are good at memorizing
information well enough to pass exams but not so good at retaining that
information and applying it in a real-world environment. These people
are more common than you might think, and that is one reason why
certification has gotten a bad name.
When the university education system reached the form that it has today,
they tried to weed out this type of person by requiring a doctoral
candidate to pass through the gauntlet of oral exams in front of a panel
of recognized experts in the field. Certification programs don't include
that step so we must do it ourselves at job interview time.
--Michael Dillon
The CCIE Lab used to be like an oral exam. Two days, pretty much
one-on-one with two proctors. There were four guys in the facility when
I took the lab, and I didn't see them at all other than the 30 minute
orientation to the lab and for an hour at supper (supervised by the
proctors). I understand it has shrunk significantly now.
CCIE salaries have not increased that much in the past 3 years.
Of the 14,000+ CCIEs:
http://www.cisco.com/web/learning/le3/ccie/certified_ccies/worldwide.html
in 2004 the average salary was $102K:
http://tcpmag.com/salarysurveys/article.asp?EditorialsID=257
whereas in 2007 it is now closer to $90K:
http://www.payscale.com/research/US/Certification=Cisco_Certified_Internetwork_Expert_(CCIE)/Salary
although here they list it here as $116K:
http://www.bradreese.com/compensation-database.htm
-Hank