This may be stupid but..

recruiters will make sure that you only see resumes with some acronym begining
with "CC", and/or "MS".

this is not useful if you are not attempting to staff to replicate those
notions of what an *sp that uses nanog needs.

two of my best hires (at sri, .5k hosts, circa 1987) were simply trainable.
an english major (f) from reed, and a cs major (m) from a school that taught
cobol as a modern language -- i hired him for his night job skills, managing
an auto body shop, managing ordinary joes holding tools.

i'm recruiter-proof. i'm not sure i'd want anyone who wasn't.

eric

Okay, I was kinda waiting a single alternative opinion of recruiters, but
since I haven't seen one, I will offer one. True, most recruiters, like
the middle part of any bell curve, tend to be...average. And as usual,
with sweeping generalizations, you could be missing out on something. In
fact, as I understand it, recruiting is one of the first steps of paying
dues when walking up the HR ladder.

There is certainly an echelon of well connected, knowledgable and trusted
recruiters that place high quality candidates into the right jobs at the
best companies. In fact, I know a few recruiters that used to be
engineers. They tend to work with people that can demand a certain minimum
salary, have years of industry experience and are currently employed.
Recruiters are just as sick of misrepresented technical folks that don't
have a clue wasting their time trying to tap jobs. Their creditabilty is
on the line with every placement. Again, as with most things, there tends
to be two ends to the spectrum.

Best Regards,
Andy Walden

Now, the problem of finding a good recruiter is substituted for the
problem of finding a good engineer :slight_smile: The trade-off is good only if
you're planning to hire dozens of engineers, considering monetary costs of
such arrangement. Even better, if you're creating a large org, get a
headhunter on board, and give him stock options - otherwise he has wrong
incentives (i.e. he's better off with job-hopping "upward mobility" type
of guys (the more expensive, the better) when he works for himself, and
you really want smart and trainable staff and don't give a damn about
perfect resume - and he's going to be cost-conscious).

--vadim

I rely on recruiters to funnel applicants to the company. I also use
Monster and jobs.perl.org to do the same. But I don't rely on them top
do much weeding.

These days, I used semi-automated remote testing to find the good
guys. I put very little faith in resumes, and do not use them to
evaluate candidates. This has worked out extremely well. I imagine
that this process is not suitable for many positions, or for cultures
that are different from Telerama's.

Check out the job posting at https://doug.telerama.com/admin_job.txt

In particular:

  DO NOT SEND YOUR RESUME at this point of the application process. If
  you do send your resume, we will assume you did not bother to
  carefully read this job posting, and we will not consider your
  application.

  To begin taking the tests, please send your public SSH key to
  jobs@telerama.com along with your email contact information. Sending
  your SSH key is the only way to signal your interest in this
  position. Please do not send a resume, cover letter, or other plea.

The last time I posted this, I received 200 total replies. 151
contained resumes, 52 contained public SSH keys, 4 contained public
PGP keys, and 1 contained a private SSH key.

One further response expressed hostility toward the requirement of a
candidate's public SSH key in order to be considered for a position.

Doug

Eric Brunner-Williams in Portland Maine wrote:
of my best hires (at sri, .5k hosts, circa 1987) were simply

trainable. an english major (f) from reed, and a cs major (m) from a
school that taught cobol as a modern language -- i hired him for his
night job skills, managing an auto body shop, managing ordinary joes
holding tools.

My best hire, now one of my good friends, was someone who was on a
teacher-training course but had to drop out due to a long term illness. She
came to me recommended by my girlfriend-a-the-time as someone who would make
a good office junior. She is now one of the bext web/perl/sql coders I know.

A willingness, nay - a NEED, to learn and be open to new concepts is what
forward moving technology sectors (like ours I hope) need.

Acronyms mean sh*t. When involved in any hiring process, I actively avoid
CCIE/MSCE/etc. laden resumes. Mentioning once, fine. Using them like
religious phrases is an indictation of, well, stupidity.

i'm recruiter-proof. i'm not sure i'd want anyone who wasn't.

Aye. I have *never* used my CV/Resume in getting a job. I still have one,
but it's very out of date.

Peter

Doug,

    Don't tease - you absolutely owe us the full text of the response from the fellow who was upset about your asking for a public SSH key as part of the interview process.

                         Neal

Doug Luce wrote:

This person obviously didn't understand the security implications
associated with handing out your public SSH key.

Also, to those that have been asking: the semi-automated test environment
was dismantled about the same time we filled the position, so we don't
have it available to go through.

Doug

Well, FORK YOU AND THE PACKET YOU WERE ENCAPSULATED IN!

    This is just priceless ... I am going to send the guy a note and find out where he is working these days :slight_smile:

Doug Luce wrote: