Is the .to (Tonga) domain completely rogue and should be removed?

Barry, you're wrong, you sound like an idiot, and I'm going to nominate you
for the very first Karl Denninger award.

You and Karl have both been around for years and both of you may be
technically proficient, but I hear stuff from both you and Karl that leaves
me shaking my head in disbelief.

(I don't work for Best, incidentally. FYI.)

But why is this "judgement" only taking place in inet-access?
  If they're really criminals, get the law after 'em.

In the immortal words of Barry Shein (bzs@world.std.com):

> All that proves is someone has a sense of humor. I've seen plenty of
> sites with these types of greetings, and they aren't hard to setup. I had
> a friend who setup his SMTP server to say:

No I think it indicates that a bunch of clowns have taken over what
advertises itself as the official US office of the Consulate of the
Kingdom of Tonga.

Um, Barry, it indicates nothing other than that they're running
"Obtuse SMTPd" -- it (and its silly smtp messages) has been around
for years now, and it's generally regarded as being a fairly
useful little package.

I'm honestly surprised that you'd never run across it before. I first
saw it about two years back while watching a manual sendmail queue
run, and about spit my coffee into the keyboard from laughing.

  http://www.obtuse.com/smtpd.html

-n

------------------------------------------------------------<memory@blank.org>
"He has been known by many names; the Prince of Lies, the Director, Lucifer,
Belial, and once, at a party, some obnoxious drunk kept calling him 'Dude'."
<http://www.blank.org/memory/>------------------------------------------------

This raises a qustion I was hoping we could avoid for quite a long
time:

Who is in a position of authority to pass judgement on whether the
assigned authority over the .to top-level domain should "be allowed" to
register such people in it's domain? Is there a policy on the root
domain? Who enforces this? Who owns it?

Cheers,
-- jra

> Oops, now I understand Karl Mueller's sarcastic, nasty remark in
> response to my note. He works for Best and Best is running this Tonga
> link.
> Aha!
> -Barry Shein

Barry, you're wrong, you sound like an idiot, and I'm going to nominate you
for the very first Karl Denninger award.

You and Karl have both been around for years and both of you may be
technically proficient, but I hear stuff from both you and Karl that leaves
me shaking my head in disbelief.

Hmmm... I'm not accustomed to _either_ of them being idiotic. Karl is
often loudmouthed and opinionated, but I usually understand where he's
coming from if I don't agree.

(I don't work for Best, incidentally. FYI.)

Me either.

Cheers,
-- jr 'my, but it's uncomfortable sounding like I'm passing judgement
on _these_ guys...' a

You don't know why it was really assigned, to who it was assigned, or what
terms it was assigned under.

Isn't it fun not being able to demand full, public, open accountability on
these types of things?

IMHO, Karl has said his share of foolish things. (Which is not to say I
never agree with him)

However, if I was to give Barry the KD award, it would be due to Barry's
hard-headedness and inability to acknowledge that maybe he's wrong and others
are right. Those are both traits that Karl has demonstrated multiple times.

Does anyone have the email address of the Chief/King of Tonga? He might
find this dialogue eye-opening...

There isn't one, there shouldn't be one, and I will resist any attempts to
put one there.

Patrick, you seem to be having a lot of trouble with the words like
"defended" and "judged".

The question was what we should do, not what they should do. For
example, should we remove their domain from the top level servers if
it has ceased to serve any legitimate purpose?

Your answer might be "no", but I think that answers your "simple
question". They can do what they like, I suppose.

But we can cut off our half of the connection if we feel it is
primarily malicious and abusive.

You seem to have not bothered to read my original description of the
problem.

The problem is mass spammers operating from within that domain forging
legitimate host names into their spam.

They're advertising a porn site within the .to domain.

HAHAHAHAHAHA!!! Someone is *really* not familiar with Polynesian
culture! :wink: 'Awa (kawa) anyone?

UHH, I think I was wrong...

me ==> </FLAME> I think he gets the idea...

'Awa (a gentleman's drink) please...

The problem is mass spammers operating from within that domain forging
legitimate host names into their spam.

Proof of mass please. (not to the lists...)

They're advertising a porn site within the .to domain.

a... as in one?

Actually, he just told me that he'd stop the spammers if I marry his
daughter.

I've taken it under consideration.

And?
.com has this problem too
So does .tj and .cc and .nu at times
A registry/registar should not have to police their domains, that isn't
their purpose in life. You are advocating taking away a countried ccTLD
because they are using it at as a gTLD.

http://www.isi.edu/in-notes/rfc1591.txt:

      In cases when there are persistent problems with the proper
      operation of a domain, the delegation may be revoked, and possibly
      delegated to another designated manager.

But that paragraph is located with describing how the TLD should
technically be operated.

Sam

I run the mail server for FREE, one of the antispam groups.

There have been many spam runs from .NET and .COM sites with our domain
forged into Received headers.

Do you hear me calling for decomissioning of the NET and COM TLDs? I think
not.

But we can cut off our half of the connection if we feel it is
primarily malicious and abusive.

So, feel free to filter any IPs you see coming to Software Tool and Die's
routers that reverse to a .to domain. Fire up your procmail filters.

But I have legitimate business with a client who is registered in the .to
TLD. Where he got that registration from really is none of my business,
from a strictly operational standpoint. My job is to make sure that my
customers can talk to him if they want/need to.

Deactivating his TLD just 'cause one guy is getting spammed by them is ...
well ... silly? I guess that means we should revoke AOL's SLD, and
Hotmail's SLD, and Yahoo's SLD ... I get spam from them -all-the-time-.

ag

> > The problem is mass spammers operating from within that domain forging
> > legitimate host names into their spam.
> > They're advertising a porn site within the .to domain.
>
> And?
> .com has this problem too

Com does not have the problem that it's nearly exclusively used for
these kinds of things.

If com had just about zero commercial sites you might have a point.

The .to domain seems to have about zero sites having anything to do
with Tonga (no one has yet pointed even one out to me) or any entity
organized within Tonga.

Even the site which appears by its name to be the Consulate of Tonga
(sfconsulate.gov.to) is an ad for a software company and says nothing
about Tonga. The San Francisco Consulate of the Kingdom of Tonga is
listed by the US State Dept as the contact point for visas etc.

That's a different kettle of fish.